Montgomery Smashing The Stigma
The statistics tell a clear story. The National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI) reports that one in five Americans live with a mental health condition. With the support of our City Council, the City began a mental health initiative to help break the stigma. As a small local government, providing treatment for mental illness was not feasible. Still, the City believes we are responsible for being a conduit and connecting people with groups and solutions that are out there when they need it most.
Montgomery Smashing The Stigma
Paula Eggebrecht - Grief During the Holidays
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Grieving during the holidays can be especially difficult, as the season often emphasizes family gatherings and joy, which may intensify feelings of loss. People mourning may experience sadness, loneliness, or anxiety, as traditions and celebrations can trigger painful memories. It's important to acknowledge these emotions and allow yourself time to heal. It’s okay to take a step back from holiday expectations. Paula Eggebrecht, School-Based and Adult Bereavement Specialist with Companions on a Journey, will be with us.
Hi everyone. You're listening to the Smashing the Stigma podcast. I'm Amy Frederick and Connie Gaylor is joining me. We're talking about grief during the holidays, something both Connie and I have experienced. We've both lost loved ones. It can be a difficult time of year.
Connie Gaylor:And we also have Paula Eggebrecht with us today. Paula is a school based and adult bereavement specialist with companions on a journey.
Amy Frederick:Companions on a journey is a faith based social service organization that provides bereavement support and educational services for children, teens, adults and families in the Greater Cincinnati region, including West Chester and Liberty Township, Ohio, as well as the surrounding Tri-State area. Paula, thank you so much for joining us today. Can you tell us about yourself and how you came to join companions on a journey?
Paula Eggebrecht:Yes, absolutely. I am a licensed social worker, and I'm one of the bereavement specialists at companions on a journey. I am part of the school facilitation team, and I'm also the liaison for the adult groups And the school facilitation team. What that includes is just we have over 70 schools that we serve monthly, and we go to into a school and provide grief support. And then I also help with volunteers and fill in wherever needed with the adult groups. And I came to find companions on a journey as I was searching for an agency to fill my internship during grad school. And I have experience in long term care and also working with a local hospice agency. And during that time, I just really resonated with helping folks with their grief journey. You know, being there for someone at the end of their life and also walking alongside their family as they're saying goodbye to their loved one and even afterwards just resonated with me. And a light switch kind of came on and I found a passion for that. So when I came across companions on a journey, I just felt like I was home, right? And so after my internship, I stayed in touch and then later became part of the staff. So I'm very grateful and thankful for the opportunity to to walk alongside those that we serve.
Connie Gaylor:Well, companions on a journey has been a great partner for us. Um, Sheila has done a community presentation for us. Um, this past year on grief. And then, then we just recently had Laura come in and we talked about childhood grief and, you know, and so this having you come in. Um, because we're right in the midst of the holidays, and we know that that can be a really hard time for people. Um, whether you're dealing with knowing that you could possibly be experiencing a loss or you already have, especially, I think for people who it's their first holiday without somebody that can be just so monumental to try to get through. So we do appreciate you coming in and speaking with us today on Holiday Grief, because we feel like it's very timely. Absolutely. You know, to get that out there. What would you say to our listeners who this may be their very first holiday? They've made it through Thanksgiving. Now, you know, Christmas and New Year's. What would you say to that person who's facing this for the first time?
Paula Eggebrecht:I would say, allow yourself some space and grace and allow yourself the time to process what it is you're feeling and don't have such high expectations. You know, the holidays, even just the anticipation of the holidays being around the corner can just really trigger us. And what I mean by triggers is just the sights, sounds and smells can can create some fear and anxiety and and questions about how we can handle that. And at this time of year is perfect to bring up the mourners bill of rights. And Doctor Alan Wolfelt wrote this. He's a big grief educator and advocate for those who are grieving. So I'll just share this with you. The mourners Bill of rights. You have the right to experience your own unique grief. You have the right to talk about your grief. You have the right to feel a multitude of emotions. You have the right to be tolerant of your physical and emotional limits. You have the right to experience grief bursts. You have the right to use the use of ritual. You have the right to embrace your spirituality. You have the right to search for meaning. You have the right to treasure your memories. You have the right to move toward your grief and heal. I think it's really important to remember that you are your best advocate. You know what's best for you. And I also want to mention that grief is hard work, and it does require intentionality and action. So as much as we want to maybe check out at times, it's important to just keep moving. You know, grief is not something that we get over. It's something that stays with us the rest of our lives. And so we really have to move through that, but also be intentional and take care of ourselves.
Connie Gaylor:Yeah, and, boy, that's hard to do when you're in the middle of it. Yes, because I think you want things to be so normal that you try to act as if you can make it normal, but it's never going to be like normal again, you know. And so I think that, um, I had never heard that. Mourners bill of rights. I haven't either. Um, and so that's very thoughtful because it's, it's taking the, the burden off the person who's going through the grief, like you said, to give yourself grace. You have the right, you have the right, you have the right. I think that that's something that you have to mentally tell yourself so that you can accept the fact that it's okay not to, to reach those levels of, of past normal tendencies and, you know, and things that you would do that it's okay just to do what you can do. Um, one thing I wanted to, to, um, put out there too, because holiday grief doesn't always mean you're dealing with the loss of a loved one as in death.
Paula Eggebrecht:Absolutely.
Connie Gaylor:It can look so different if you've went through a divorce or you've had to make a major life change, that's totally upended how you would normally celebrate. So I'm just saying that because and we say we've said this when we had the childhood grief as well, it's so that listeners don't think your grief can only be around death. It can be around just other things that you know, has caused, you know, a void somehow in your life. So, you know, I'm just mentioning that for the benefit of anybody who listens so that they know, you know, that they can fill that grief in other ways.
Paula Eggebrecht:Absolutely. And I think it's also important to mention that on top of grief, you know, grief changes the family dynamic, too. And how we spend our holidays and relationships change after that. So, you know, there's a lot of voids, but absolutely. And just giving yourself grace, whether it is a loss or just the absence of someone I know. Also working with elders and seeing how families are dispersed across the country and even further international. It's it's hard to be alone during the holidays. And so just coming up with new ways to celebrate or even to just get through the holidays. It's just important to show yourself grace.
Connie Gaylor:No, I totally agree.
Amy Frederick:I think that's a great point. I remember when I lost my father, I think it was 2021. He had passed away in January and then by December there's definitely a loss. The things that you're doing to celebrate. We all have our family traditions, no matter what that is. But there was definitely a feeling that something was missing. But you still want to go ahead and have the holidays and celebrate? Sure. And, um, especially if you have young children. So if you have children in your house and you're grieving a loss of something like a grandparent or a loved one or something, How does that change for people with kids and grieving?
Paula Eggebrecht:I know from my own experience, I lost my parents within the span of two years and then also lost a sibling, and I had a time of mourning where I didn't feel like celebrating, and I kind of checked out for a couple of months. I just could not process all that had happened. I mean, I was an orphan, right? Totally. And I came from a huge family, and I kind of put off doing some of those traditions. And finally, one of my kids said, aren't we good enough? And it just really opened up my eyes. You know, we all really have something to be grateful for. Yes, we're missing our loved ones. And yes, our life has changed. But there are so many people living around us who care about us and we care about them. And so I think just being grateful for what is there. And I also like to take maybe the past things and bring them into the future. After that moment, it was very important for me to keep my my parents memory alive for my children and keep their legacy going. So what we did, we took some old traditions and added some new and just started our holidays fresh like that.
Amy Frederick:I think that's actually a really great idea. It's not that you're trying to forget the memories that you had of your loved one, but you're trying something new and something different. I think that's a really great idea for people.
Paula Eggebrecht:And we have to remember they're a part of us and we're a part of them, and we carry them wherever we go. And, you know, talking about grief, I think sometimes we totally forget that the love we had for our loved one has to go somewhere. Right? And I often say, that's the grief, you know? But I love to focus on the love part and not necessarily the sadness and things that we associate with the word grief. So I think it's important just to, to highlight that it's all about the love that we had for that loved one. And we still have and and celebrate that. And oftentimes that means changing our traditions.
Connie Gaylor:When, you know, back to just the teenager and the children, different ages. And we talked about childhood grief with with Laura and they exhibited differently. Um, sometimes they don't exhibit at all. They just try to button up, which we do too, as adults. You know, we want to just check out and not deal, you know? But, um, you know, the new traditions, the old traditions. That is an action. How do you deal with the emotion of that with, you know, when you're grieving yourself, you know, because you can't necessarily push yours down just so that you can get your kids through. They're going to pick up on it. Kids are much smarter than we give them credit for. So how, you know, is, is that when you turn to, you know, to counseling or, you know, to therapy, um, you know, when's the right time to do that?
Paula Eggebrecht:Being a licensed social worker, I am all for counseling. I think all of us could benefit from that. Having someone to talk to, especially someone that is not in our circle. You know someone who is unbiased. I think for me and for other situations that I have been involved in, communication is key, especially with our kids. I think it's important to remember that kids are watching us and they're watching how we mourn, right? And they're learning from us. We are their. We're their role model. And so how we process things, they're going to pick up and follow suit. And keeping that communication open, even though they may not talk, they may not be able to express what they're feeling. I know that companions on a journey, we use a slinky and we use that to symbolize finding balance. And we often talk about finding the people, the places, and the things that bring us up on those rough times. And I sometimes even bring in just the image of a rubber rubber band ball, because for me, grief, sometimes it's just a ball of emotions. It's, it's it's a messy thing, but if you can imagine all of those rubber bands in a ball and explain that to a child. I mean, can you imagine being a child and trying to explain this ball of emotions, right? Or being able to just pick out one? So when you're opening the door and providing opportunities to to have kids express what they're feeling and they don't, maybe providing an activity that would be, um, you know, insightful to them and where they might have an aha, that's what I'm feeling. Or be able to express at least something that they're going through.
Connie Gaylor:That's good, because that can be the hardest thing, I think, to, to navigate. I mean, you've lost a parent. I've lost. I'm I kind of have become orphaned, like you said, at the same time. And, um, you know, leading my adult, adult daughters through some of it, even though you feel like, well, they're older, they'll be able to handle it. You know, it's they were still having a tough time, and we're still looking at me in a lot of ways to encourage them to, you know, and we all feel it differently at different times. You know, you always talk about how it can just come over you like a wave out of nowhere. I could be sitting in my office one day, hear something and be in there ready to bawl. Nobody knows, you know. But with your kids, they want you to teach them to be resilient, even at that age. Absolutely. You know, and so it is hard it is hard to to pick up and carry on. You know, you've seen people sometimes will leave a chair at the table with the place setting, and that is for the loved one that they've missed. We go to weddings and there's, you know, there's semblances of people that aren't there, but we're still remembering them. So it's the being able to know that you can remember and grieve at the same time, you know, and moving forward doesn't mean you're you're pushing it away. Absolutely. You Absolutely. I think that's that's a hard thing. And sometimes that's hard for kids, even teenagers, young adults to understand.
Paula Eggebrecht:And I like to bring up that joy and sorrow can coexist, especially for kids, because one minute they can be so tearful and agitated and angry and just so confused, and the next minute be laughing at something on TV and then guilt might set in. They're like, why am I feeling happy? I shouldn't be feeling happy. My parents are crying, my aunts are crying. And it's just important to let them know that you can have multiple emotions, especially joy and sorrow, and just try to eliminate that emotion of guilt for them.
Connie Gaylor:Mhm.
Amy Frederick:You talked about that place setting that, you know, a tradition that a lot of people leave that place for somebody that they've lost at the table. Do you have any other ideas for listeners of other ways they might be able to honor a loved one that they've lost during the holidays?
Paula Eggebrecht:Sure. I know for my family, my father lived with us after my mother passed away. And so his his empty chair at our table was very powerful. And my one said, my one son said, I'm getting the prayer chair because my dad would always pray before dinner. And I just thought that was really sweet. So that became a new tradition, right? But some things that can be helpful to bring a loved one into the present, um, could be something as simple as lighting a candle, doing something in honor of them. It could be donating your time, or even donating a minimal amount of money to a charity that that that meant the world to them. Um, tangible items are really helpful too, especially with kids if you have something that belonged to your loved one. Um, I know when my parents passed away, I had saved some rose petals and had those made into rose beads and made jewelry for all of my kids to let them know that, you know, they're here. They're still here with you. It's just a different way. And the relationship still resist. It's just in a different way. Right. And I also want to talk about Doctor Wolfelt again, because he has a quote that I often rely on when words are inadequate, create a ceremony. And I think the definition and interpretation of ceremony could mean so many different things. Again, it could just be lighting one candle. It could be creating a time where family members come together and talk about the loved one, have a book and write all of the stories that they they have of their loved one. Even the characteristics of that person and how that person influenced them. There's so many ways to create a ceremony, if you will. We could volunteer at a soup kitchen, have a meal with somebody who's less fortunate. Again, gratitude is so important. And, you know, that's so therapeutic when we give of our time and help someone else. So that also helps someone else. But it also starts the healing for ourselves.
Connie Gaylor:Yeah, that's a great idea. That is a great idea because I remember after I guess it was probably last year, I wasn't able to be with family at Christmas. So I had a big woe is me pity party. You know, I, I got stubborn, I had friends say, well, why don't you come, you know, and you don't want to go to somebody's house on Christmas when they're having their entire family thing, because all it does is remind you that you're by yourself. So checking out was my way of dealing, you know. And was that healthy? No. Did it put guilt on my kids because we couldn't be together? It did. So that wasn't the right way to handle it. You know, so I do think volunteering and just getting out of your home during that day and seeing the plight of others that's even in your grief is much harder for them, you know, in their lives. Does help you kind of balance things back out. You know, but it is easy to just want to sit and do nothing. And and it's hard for people, I think, sometimes to understand because they think, well, just come be with me and it's. And they're being generous and thoughtful and loving in that action. But you feel like you're kind of out of place, you know. And that's when I think the grief is probably, you know, one of the worst times. And that's another thing is, you know, sometimes when do you feel like, you know, we have a loved one who's grieving to the point that it's it's getting, um, I don't want to say dangerous, but very concerning, you know, to the point that maybe they're going to take some kind of, of action, you know, on themselves. When do you feel like there could be indicators for that, that you need to be watching for?
Paula Eggebrecht:I think if you have prolonged checking out periods, you know, of course, we want you to do what's best for you. And there is nothing wrong with staying in your pajamas all day, right? Or even staying in bed all day. We just don't want that to be a habit that continues day after day after day. Oftentimes, we'll say, if you're experiencing true signs of depression or deep depression after two weeks, talk to your doctor about it. Talk to your doctor if you're having trouble sleeping. But that's where the self-care comes into and the intentionality. Like I said, grief is hard work and it requires action. And we often say, and I know everyone's heard. Take one day at a time, but sometimes it's one moment at a time, right? The the grief can be so, so severe that we just don't even know what to do next. But absolutely, for us who have friends and family who are mourning, we definitely want to check in with them and make sure that they're not in bed every day. You know, for a week at a time or something. And as I said before, counseling is wonderful. I think everyone would benefit from having someone to talk to and process those feelings. And, you know, it's not about having the answers. And a lot of us, when we're trying to help someone who's grieving, if you're if you're a fixer kind of a person, you want to make this all go away and you want to make it better. But grief is not something that can be fixed. It's something that we have to move through. And a lot of that involves talking, asking the right questions, the right prompts just to get the person to realize what it is that they're feeling so that we can process that and move forward.
Connie Gaylor:Well, I think having a strong support system absolutely is, is you have to have that.
Paula Eggebrecht:Absolutely.
Amy Frederick:That's what I think too, is also key with the Bill of rights that you have never heard that put into words. But I think giving yourself permission to is a big thing. Yes. You can't. You know, sometimes you think you have to kind of get moving or I have to do all the things I need to do so that my kids can be happy during the holidays. But I think this Bill of rights kind of gives people permission to just take a moment and kind of think about yourself, because I know a lot of parents mostly put their kids first, but it gives you permission to kind of think things through to just to just a breath of fresh air.
Paula Eggebrecht:It does. And we have to take care of ourselves right before we can take care of our children. So just like that oxygen mask, we have to put it on before we can help our children get theirs on. So it does. It really does give us permission. And again, it really goes down to you are the best advocate for yourself and you know what is right for you. And you know, grief can bring on so many physical symptoms, um, you know, fatigue, lack of concentration. So really taking care of yourself is so important. That healthy diet, getting enough sleep, exercise, if you can, really will be helpful.
Amy Frederick:Is there anything else that you can say to somebody to help draw out their feelings or thoughts?
Paula Eggebrecht:Absolutely, absolutely.
Amy Frederick:Some of those be because the first thought everybody says is, I'm sorry, is there something else people we could be saying, absolutely.
Paula Eggebrecht:Tell me about your loved one. Tell me your favorite story. What's your favorite thing about your loved one? What are some things you loved about about them? Were they kind? Were they sweet? Um, what's what's some of the things that you like to do with them when you guys were together? Focus on that because really, people want to talk about their loved one. They don't want the memory of their loved one to die. Right. Because it's very much alive in their heart, mind and soul. And so asking those prompts will will open up the dialogue. And once they start talking, you may see some of those words that are attached to emotions come out. And then you can kind of talk about it.
Connie Gaylor:You know, I mean, I know and I've talked to people and, you know, I don't know how many times after my mom passed away, she's in a better place. Yes, sure. Okay. Maybe she is, but she's not here.
Paula Eggebrecht:Right.
Connie Gaylor:Right. You know, or you know, at least she's not suffering, you know, and I don't think people know what to say, so they just go back to cliches.
Paula Eggebrecht:I talked to a participant in one of our adult groups not long ago, and this person thanked me for just listening. She had gone to counseling, and the counselor was just trying to give her solutions to help her feel better. And she goes, really? I'm not. I don't want to be fixed. I just want somebody to listen. And so really, that's what we all really want, right? We want our feelings to be validated. We want to know we're not alone, and we want to know what we're feeling is normal. And it is regardless of what you're feeling, because grief is so unique and individualized. No two grief journeys are the same. So what you are feeling is normal. And and you know another thing we when we are helping a friend or a loved one who is grieving, we don't want to put that ball in their court and say, let me know if you need anything, because the truth is, they may not know what they need at that moment, right? They are just so overwhelmed with grief and they may not even reach out for help, even if they do know, you know, it's just the way it is. So if you have a skill or a talent, you know, just offer that up. Say, I'm very good at cooking. I can bring you five meals this week or something like that. Just don't leave the ball in their court because they're probably not going to call you, right? Yeah, I think.
Amy Frederick:That's I think everybody says that call me if you. But I think that's an excellent point, an excellent idea that you have I totally agree. Yeah.
Connie Gaylor:No, I do too, because, um. Their pride. Yes. You know, of wanting to seem like they have it all together sure is going to keep them from letting somebody into their home. Sure. To see, you know, just how how hard it is on them. I think that's human nature. It is, it is.
Paula Eggebrecht:I don't think anyone wants to be labeled needy or in need. Right? Right, right. But and oftentimes I will tell folks, too, it's okay to tell people what you want. You, as the griever, have the opportunity to educate those who love you. People really do want to be there for you. They just don't know how to say it. Sometimes and sometimes hurtful things can be said, you know? I know for me, when my father passed, I had someone in church, of all places say something inappropriate. It was something to the point of you're still mourning or you're still grieving. Basically just giving me a cue that I should be over this. And grief is just not something that you get over. You know, you move through it, but you don't get over it. But back to what we were saying before too, is inviting people to talk about their loved one. You know, there's healing and talking about your loved one and sharing the stories, and then there's healing and listening to other stories, too. And oftentimes we can get ideas of coping strategies by hearing someone else's stories. You know, what worked for them may not work for you, but it might. It might be something that you say, oh, I might try that and see if that works. So there's healing and telling our story and also hearing others.
Connie Gaylor:What kind of services does companion on a journey offer? I mean, is this individual family? I mean, what can you give us an idea of some of the things that you do?
Paula Eggebrecht:Sure, sure. We do have our school groups. Um, like I said, we go into 70 plus schools a month, and we provide grief support for kindergartners through high school age. And then we also have adult groups. And what I love about Koga is we're very different. We have specific to loss groups. We have a hope and healing after suicide. We have a bereavement parent group. We have two widowed groups. So and then of course, we also have caring for the grieving hearts that has various different losses in the group. But it's very important sometimes to just find someone who has experienced the same type of loss as you. You can really relate and form some bonds there to help that healing process. We do offer a group for families and children called Mending Hearts. That's very important where parents, guardians or family members bring the children and even teens together and and we come together, we have a light dinner, and then we usually have an activity that's very thought provoking. And then and that usually opens up the dialogue for emotions that we might be feeling. And oftentimes parents and the guardians will, will be enlightened by that because they may not the child may not be talking at home, but yet they'll share this in this group.
Connie Gaylor:Well, and I'm sure you have a way of bringing things out. Yes. That you can't do at home, right? Because when you're grieving, you're not approaching a conversation the same way as you. You know the professional who knows how to lead those conversations and even lead them when they kind of go off the rails a little bit. Because when you start to try to have conversations like this with your kids, and then all of a sudden there's an outburst of tears or anger, you know, then all of a sudden you're derailed, and then you're focused on just managing that emotion that they're feeling at the moment. Whereas I'm sure, you know, the professionals there at Koge know how to guide that, you know, to, to provide comfort, but also, you know, to facilitate that so that maybe somebody walks away understanding why they felt that way a little bit more, or making a connection with their family member at the same time.
Paula Eggebrecht:It's very eye opening for our adults to come. And even the students, the children and the teens, it's very eye opening. And then we also have one on one available. We have consultations for one on one and then even ongoing support if that's what an individual or family needs. Yeah.
Amy Frederick:What's the best way for people to get get Ahold of you or learn about the the services that companions on a journey offers.
Paula Eggebrecht:So listeners can call our office? The number is (513) 870-9108. They can also check out our website at companions on a journey. Org. We also have a Facebook page. Our website has an up to date calendar. It also describes our groups more in depth and there's also some resources there too. They're a.
Connie Gaylor:Great resource. I've really went through those and you guys have a lot of really good.
Paula Eggebrecht:Even for the holidays. Just under that resource tab, there's some helpful information to get you through the holidays and understand grief.
Connie Gaylor:Mhm. No, I totally agree. I was very impressed because I was just doing some background, you know, research or I guess you would say, and I was very impressed with your, with your website Whoever does go on that website, you will find something for what you're going through that will be helpful. You know, that was awesome. Yeah. Anything else that you wanted to to bring out that maybe we didn't touch on?
Paula Eggebrecht:I would say, you know, grief is just so hard during the holidays and those emotions intensify. I think just focus on controlling what you can control is just very helpful. And that that involves planning ahead, maybe even scheduling your grief. Oftentimes I've heard folks say, you know, just scheduling my grief like 12 to 1. I know it's going to be a tough day, but I'm going to take that hour and I am going to think about my loved one and whatever emotions come out during that time, I am going to accept those and give in to those. So maybe it's an hour of crying, but then knowing after that I am getting up and I'm going to enjoy my family or my friends or whatever it is I have planned for that day. Yeah.
Connie Gaylor:That's great.
Amy Frederick:I think that's a great idea for everybody. Well, thank you for joining us. Thank you for thank you for listening.